Question on using 580EXII and other manual flash

[Dream Merchant]

I've been going through the 580EX2 manual till my eye kenar pop liao.

Simply, can I use the 580EX2 on my camera, with a radio slave plugged into my camera's PC output in the following situation:

1) With a Metz hammerhead flash hooked up with a radio receiver. Metz set on Auto (say ISO 400 f/8) bounced off another part of the room and the hotshoe 580EX2 set to Auto External Metering? But if I use optical slaves, would it work? I know the metering works in Real Time, so I assume there is NO pre-flash. Does that sound correct? Will the radio slave work while the 580EX2 is hotshe mounted, and set to Auto External Metering?

Also, looking at the footnote of the 580EX2 manual, pg 31, it says that when using External Auto Metering, I cannot connect another speedlight via the PC sync cord. Does this mean that my radio slave will not fir if I have a 580EX2 mounted, set to External Auto Metering, and my radio trigger plugged into my camera PC cord outlet?

2) With a Metz hammerhead flash with radio receiver. Metz set on Auto (say ISO 400 f/8) bounced off another part of the room and the hotshoe 580EX2 set to ETTL II? Does the ETTL thingy work purely on preflash only, meaning, it would just pre-flash, take a reading without regarding the extra light to be provided by the Metz unit, which would fire only when the shutter is open? Result = massively over-exposed shots? Is that what would likely happen?

3) Using the flash and/or camera's cFn, can I set the 580EX2 to be constantly updated with changes in camera ISO and aperture information in Auto External Metering?

Sorry for these questions, but I am totally unfamiliar with the 580EX2 and I can't afford to get bogged down with a massively expensive accessory which I can't use with my intended set-up.

Also, what does a new 580EX2 cost, grey or with Canon SG warranty?

Appreciate any assistance.

CHEERS!

[wf7850]

Also, what does a new 580EX2 cost, grey or with Canon SG warranty?

hey DM, sorry i can onli help u with pricing 
Canon SG - $710 (OP)
Grey - $650 (OP)
Int'l warranty - $650 (Oracle and some other online sellers in CS)

[Michael]

if your metz flashes when it senses another flash, the camera + 580 preflash would also trigger the metz, adjusting the output based on both the 580 and the metz. not too sure abt the details, u get a 580, u have metz, just try it out :p

[Dream Merchant]

Thanks Willy.

Thanks Mikey. Hmm ... to get and try ah ... gonna cost $650 - $710. Sekali cannot work how? 

[boredphuck]

sipeh confusing. why u need so many things to operate 2 flash? what abt ur current method of using the optical slaves?

[wf7850]

Hmm ... to get and try ah ... gonna cost $650 - $710. Sekali cannot work how? 

see when u free n me can make it, we meet n i lend u my 580 to try it out lor, aye mai...? 

[Dream Merchant]

sipeh confusing. why u need so many things to operate 2 flash? what abt ur current method of using the optical slaves?

Solutions need to be found as needs evolve.

Besides, kenar poison by your strobist work mah! All your fault!   

[Dream Merchant]

see when u free n me can make it, we meet n i lend u my 580 to try it out lor, aye mai...? 

OK! That sounds KEWL Willy! Will PM you to arrange.

[boredphuck]

Solutions need to be found as needs evolve.

Besides, kenar poison by your strobist work mah! All your fault!   

wah lau. u making it too complicated just to shoot on ettl leh. here plug one there plug one. why dun u just use a optical slave on the metz and run that on manual and the 580 on camera on ettl?

[wf7850]

OK! That sounds KEWL Willy! Will PM you to arrange.

Sure...!! 

[Dream Merchant]

ETTL uses pre-flash right? How to use my opticals?

External Auto Metering, according to the manual, does not use a pre-flash, buuut, it says that when set to EAM, hooking another speedlight via PC cord won't work, so I'm wondering if when using EAM, can a radio trigger via PC cord fire?

Unfortunately, with digital equipment, settings etc have gotten so complicated unlike the old days.

Have to find out the capabilities and limitations of our equipment rite? Especially luan flash like 580EX IIs and the like.

Hmm...another thought came to mind.

Even if I have both Metz units with radio receivers (so no problm with ETTL pre-flash), doesn't ETTL use pre-flash to determine correct exposure?

Meaning, BEFORE the Metz units fire, the 580 2 will already determine an exposure it thinks is 'correct' based on it's pre-flash? Then when all the units fire, won't it be grossly over-exposed, or does ETTL perform real time exposure adjustments during the exposure itself to fine-tune?

[Dream Merchant]

Sorry BP, I forgot to clarify. I'm talking about 3 units at the moment, and more or less as needed so it's not just a matter of remotely triggering one unit. I can understand why you earlier thought that I was being complicated. My baad.

[UKay]

ETTL uses pre-flash right? How to use my opticals?

External Auto Metering, according to the manual, does not use a pre-flash, buuut, it says that when set to EAM, hooking another speedlight via PC cord won't work, so I'm wondering if when using EAM, can a radio trigger via PC cord fire?

Unfortunately, with digital equipment, settings etc have gotten so complicated unlike the old days.

Have to find out the capabilities and limitations of our equipment rite? Especially luan flash like 580EX IIs and the like.

Hmm...another thought came to mind.

Even if I have both Metz units with radio receivers (so no problm with ETTL pre-flash), doesn't ETTL use pre-flash to determine correct exposure?

Meaning, BEFORE the Metz units fire, the 580 2 will already determine an exposure it thinks is 'correct' based on it's pre-flash? Then when all the units fire, won't it be grossly over-exposed, or does ETTL perform real time exposure adjustments during the exposure itself to fine-tune?

by right if u use it this way it should not screw up ur exposure... unless all ur metz heads are aiming directly on the subject. And if i am not wrong there is a manual overide exposure lock on the 580... so u can try that out...

[boredphuck]

ETTL uses pre-flash right? How to use my opticals?

External Auto Metering, according to the manual, does not use a pre-flash, buuut, it says that when set to EAM, hooking another speedlight via PC cord won't work, so I'm wondering if when using EAM, can a radio trigger via PC cord fire?

Unfortunately, with digital equipment, settings etc have gotten so complicated unlike the old days.

Have to find out the capabilities and limitations of our equipment rite? Especially luan flash like 580EX IIs and the like.

Hmm...another thought came to mind.

Even if I have both Metz units with radio receivers (so no problm with ETTL pre-flash), doesn't ETTL use pre-flash to determine correct exposure?

Meaning, BEFORE the Metz units fire, the 580 2 will already determine an exposure it thinks is 'correct' based on it's pre-flash? Then when all the units fire, won't it be grossly over-exposed, or does ETTL perform real time exposure adjustments during the exposure itself to fine-tune?

i don't think the flash is capable of real time adjustments. but having said that, i don't see it a big problem as getting a consistent and reliable output. i realise the 580's output is inconsistent as u told me before.

[Dream Merchant]

by right if u use it this way it should not screw up ur exposure... unless all ur metz heads are aiming directly on the subject. And if i am not wrong there is a manual overide exposure lock on the 580... so u can try that out...

Thanks Ukay. I'm going to look more into the manual and learn about the 580 before comitting.

HAIZ. So sad Metz doesn't have a real service agent here. If not, I'll be looking at the MZ series already. Damned nice units once you get used to the controls.